Emotions versus logic. Most people work to keep their bills paid, not to signify their approval or respect for their employer. I know for me, if I was working with my friend there is no way that I would be able to respect boundaries all the time. I cant tell how close your friends job would be to your old job, but either its too close or this is you projecting those fears onto your friend. is it OK for my employee to do needlepoint in meetings? my employee is job-searching should I tell my manager? I do not want to nitpick OPs words, and I truly appreciate her sincerity because there are not many people who can do this. Im not really going to argue with you, as I dont think I have a good leg to stand on! Yeah. The second time this happened, I was a long-term possible temp-to-hire at a law firm and all of the temps from my particular staffing agency were let go for budget reasons. I totally understand where your feelings are coming from! Knowing that the nervousness lasted your full time working there is a very good incentive for me to let it go and know that I would likely be unhappy even if the job miraculously came back. You need to get your story straight. Tech jobs (Coders, computer programmers, software engineers, data analysts) Coders, software developers, and data analysts could be displaced by AI, an expert says. Agreed. Maybe the takeaway here should be its a great place to consult, but not a very reliable or loyal employer. They laid OP off, but thats business. I guess its like if one of my less salubrious exes offered to get back with me sure I had a great time with them but it ended badly and Id not trust them. I dont see where thats happening here. You might not think its a big deal but you can internalize some of the things that happen at work. Why would you even now feel that you would go back to them in a heartbeat if you know from bitter experience that your skills and abilities wont be enough to keep you in the job? OP, I think part of the problem is you havent moved on from this job. A good friend should understand and give you some space to work through what youre working through. And for a lot of people, cutting spending isnt something they can do in a month, especially if they have a lot of debt. Ive since cooled off (the letter was part of how to do thatI didnt want to take out my likely unjustified feelings on my friend or our mutual friends, but also really needed to get an outside reality check). Thats unfortunate. That the reconstitution of the department is final. If you look at the photo in your head of her applying there and later accepting employment there, you are not looking at the whole story. After I didnt, he tried to stay friends with me for a while. When things are going well, youll be comfortable enough to stop by your friends office to say, I totally just nailed that presentation! And when it comes to brainstorming, youll love how easy it is to let the ideas flyno matter how silly, strange, or completely impractical they are. I wouldnt ever go out of my way to try to snipe a job from my friend, also, because I agree with you that it wouldnt lead anywhere good. We feel what we feel, and the more you try to bury or dismiss those feelings because they are wrong the more resentment will build. To my friends credit, it was a layoff of.one. Reddit, Inc. 2023. I on the other hand work for a company that is currently hiring new employees, I think my friend would be perfect for the job. Like WTF how could she like that post knowing what he did to me??? So I would feel absolutely no obligation towards my friend in this sense, and if they held it against me that I accepted a post in a company that dismissed them, Id consider it to be very weird. You might lose them as friends, but that's what they get when they expect you to ignore their past poor performance and still hire them. I think youre right about the confusion, and that might be some of the reason that OP is having trouble resolving this too. If you haven't been given new tasks or you are bored with the tasks you've had, it may be time to look for something new. The person they inserted into my role retired a few months ago and seeing my old position posted broke my heart. ? which added a layer of frustration to the bad-feelings-cake. Really, if you are laid off it sucks either way. Moreover, OP herself says I would take back my job in a heartbeat if it became available, I loved everything about it, which sounds a bit confusing as to the resentment. I think OP needs to find a way to distance from the idea this is the one and only dream job for their lifetime. Im not saying the company did anything wrong, per say (though I find giving someone new work at 11am and dismissing them at 1pm to be shady AF). I had advance warning, and vastly prefer it. As I've moved up in my company, this has come up a couple of times. I know my friend could do the job fairly okay-ish (I do believe that it is above their experience level) and the reasons I dont want to help them are totally personal. I think my friend is excellent at what they do, but that the job in question is a bit outside their wheelhouse and quite high up in the department structure. There is no good reason for me to gatekeep this job or this company from them except for my hurt feelings. I liked the me that let go of the anger and feelings of unfair much better, and so I focused on taking small actions that supported my friend. I think thats a bit of what I was doing by writing the letter! He gave them a polite, yet firm, email about why he would never work for them. But it absolutely added to the feeling of I am the thing that sucks knowing that what happened is exceptionally uncommon. I have since found a similar role in a different school and am very happy here but the feeling of betrayal from that job is still there. Feelings are just what they are, neither good nor bad. Ill be honest, Im kind of surprised that the LWs friend is willing to apply for a company that laid off LW so suddenly. I suspect there are two things going on. You would have someone really rooting for you on the inside and might be privy to new openings or contract projects. How stupid will I sound if I tell them I think they are being weirdly inconsiderate by assuming that I would be enthusastic for them? Ive been laid off from more than one great company who treated their employees well, If a friend got a job there, Id wish them well and Id encourage them to apply, if it was a good job for them. Me and my best friend have similar backgrounds, and both do the same general type of work in the same field. Perhaps your friend remembered how painful the whole thing was for you, and did not want to make you feel bad by asking you for advice for a job at that same employer. I dont think it was actively malicious, but if she is so valuable to be tapped for contract work it seems strange that she wasnt moved into the department she set up in some capacity. Similar places.the same bureaucracy is in place to allow a wide range of very problematic workplace environments to emerge. I know you didnt ask about that, but just throweing it out there. Personally I would probably consider putting some space between me and the friend for a bit and would bow out of giving a reference. 342. Real friends don't pull this kind of crap. There was huge fallout, and he lost multiple friends over that email. For example, there was a letter not long ago about someone thinking it was unethical to stay in a job they liked long-term, because someone else wanted to apply. It also happened to be my friends favorite diehard sports team. BUT Id remind her that I was happy in the job and got an hours notice to leave. You can voice your opinion about how strongly you disagree with her choice of advertising strategies, but when it comes down to it, its her businessand ultimately, she calls the shots. Youd think that being told you have done nothing wrong when being let go is the ideal situation, but it was horrible to know there was no way I could have helped myself and that my skills and abilities were not at all part of the decision to let me go. Thanks for the input. What if she is always late, never does the work, and is a general mess of a coworker? Help. Some people do that! I am ambivalent on the question of friendship loyalty. Can you stop your friend? But there really hasnt been a full break there. But if its not close? And take the reverse into consideration as well: When you have a rough week, miss an important deadline, or show up late a few too many mornings in a row, your friend is probably going to call you into her office for a stern sit-down. He worked in sports so obviously I felt extremely angry and petty and wanted his team (his employer) to lose every game. Also, sometimes we really do just have emotional responses to things. Perhaps you can try to counter-balance your upset with your friend by saying to yourself but I know how this company really is.. my amusement. The fact that the OP is taking this as a personal blow concerns me. You can take responsibility for being weird about it, but still set the boundary you need to set. You know your friend as someone who you can share your deepest secrets with and not as a colleague. We had to sell our house and leave the state and the support structure wed built up over 20 years. The kicker? Your friend working at your job is a bad idea, working together can ruin the friendship because the lines of authority can be blurred. What if you become your friend's supervisor, imagine drinking during the weekend and going wild with your friend knowing and . Its not okay to ignore your future to dwell on them. Im glad you found a new position. Id suggest working on dealing with having been laid off, possibly through therapy. IME its way worse to try and bury or deny or try and rationalize your way out of actually feeling them than just letting them run their course. I know the one place I worked still has that in place, and I strongly advise against working there. Its not foolproof but it does help cut back on the number of times I forget to attach the file. But Im of the opinion that you need to keep it to yourself because they havent done anything wrong. she was entitled to, and that the support she received from her friend was emotional, not practical. The OP cant make them hire her back any more than she can reply to someone breaking up with her with no you dont. It is not personal and definitely in this case has nothing to do with skills. Since shes the boss, shell alwaysyes, alwayshave the final say. And when I say suddenly, I mean one hour I was being given tasks and the next hour I was told they were coming to collect my work computer. If your answer is no, then put your feelings aside and be happy or at least neutral for your friend. The shifts are short (often like 2-4 hours) and only require 2 people to work them at a time. She became a customer, and I had awful, aggressive communications from her side so far. when should I tell my friend I applied for a job she wants? Or if this is a very niche field or a rural area with few jobs, then maybe but if there are other options I cant imagine why someone would do this. yeah, your friend might not see it that way, and might still be annoyed with you. And sometimes the answer is that youre the lowest performer in the area theyre keeping, or that you were rude to the receptionist, or that you told the boss she was wrong. Emotions are strange things and I dont want whatever this is to hurt my friendship with you.. I think youre thinking of the Actor-Observer Bias. And OP your friend did not have to ask for your input or permission to apply to your former employer, so get that out of your head. Is OP employed now, and if so, how do they feel about the new job? A few months later after a lot of others quit, they reached out to try and recruit him. Despite the way the letter sounds, Im generally hard to rattle and it wouldnt surprise me if it just didnt cross their mind that I might be a little less chill on the inside than on the outside about this one. Ive been described as even-tempered and someone that gets along well with others. The friend isnt desperate for a job, theyre just unsatisfied in their current job and looking for a change. Listen with empathy, and work on detaching your desire for your old job from Friends desire for this separate job. The point is you have the potential to overwork yourself doing things such as sucking up to the boss just to get one up over your friend, its exhausting. Friends and money are both big parts of our lives, so overlap is almost inevitable. I am thinking of what is best for my survival, not so much loyalty to my friend. Youre still desperately holding on to hope youll work there again. Im glad youre ok and have a job you like! I didnt mean it to be. Im so sorry that happened to you! I also dont really want to mix my work life and personal life as it would add more stress to my job and the kennel job is literally the only job that I have ever been comfortable with. She is working with them still, which looks, at least to me, like there arent hard feelings. Then out comes the competitiveness in both of you, and one or both of you will walk around thinking my friend wants to be me, maybe you will be right or maybe you will be wrong. This was a full on blue-screen-of-death short circuit. 100%! He worked there for a month, then quit in a huff. Generally once Ive done this I find with time the rants justgo away. Both places let me work out the day and then let me go at the end of the day. What if you become your friends supervisor, imagine drinking during the weekend and going wild with your friend knowing and seeing the wild you, but come Monday, you have to call her to order. apply for a job). Theyre not worth it. Being unfairly associated with a slacking colleague. I do not understand the disconnect here- they are hurting the members of the society that sustains their livelihood. You cant expect to be treated differently because youre friends with the boss. So I extra want to shout about it. This happens all the time, your friend will want to prove herself to the big boss, and what happens when all of a sudden she starts getting all the praise, what happens when the job you used to do gets given to her? I didnt expect to feel so defensive when my friend critiqued my ideas or work, but those feelings quickly seeped into our friendship. Im worried my team will fall apart if I take maternity leave, my coworkers demand a response to every single email even thank yous, director secretly hired her daughters boyfriend, dealing with a needy customer, and more. Totally be there and be super supportive of the friend when the latter applies to other companies, but I dont think theres anything wrong with the OP telling the friend that she appreciates everything friend did after her layoff, but because of the freshness of that situation, OP needs to take a step back from anything having to do with this company for now while still wishing the friend luck. you would be happy to work for them again. A place to discuss career options, to ask questions and give advice! Thats too much love to put on any job jobs let people down. I realize thats very extra, nor would I ever say anything to her, or in reality even hold it against her, I get it, and that my vendetta (not really) is not hers, but I couldnt help but feel a little stab when I saw that. OP feels like contracting means not good enough to hire. Its rough but its good that you know what your friend is doing. Personal relationships arent business arrangements and shouldnt be, but you should both still be getting something *mutually beneficial* out of them, and if you arent, its okay to leave/accept that the end or change of that relationship isnt something done at you per seand you should not make continual sacrifices of your own self and happiness over and over in an unbalanced way: She's going to have questions. And Im unconvinced the friend should reduce her options out of loyalty. I wish Id had the confidence to say hey, I support you, but I cant be the person you tell all this to.. Bad things happen to people who have done nothing wrong. I was pretty new in my career, so very low on the ladder, but most of my team were well known and very established. To gather what one gets from a business relationship (should be immediate, legal). Just because some companies are doing this does not make it all okay. Find an outlet for them writing in a journal, ranting to yourself while driving alone in the car (yeah, my favourite! (That said, I agree that if I were the friend I would think from the contact work that things were peachier than they are.) Do you realllllllly want to break them up? A Maryland judge struck down the 2017 sex-abuse convictions of former Montgomery County third-grade teacher John Vigna, ruling that his lawyer performed so badly six years . I do not think I would refuse an otherwise interesting job just out of loyalty to my friend if I myself did not see any red flags. It comes more down to LW feeling inferior than a sense of their friend must be loyal to them. Are redundancies nice? You might need to stop contracting. LW I also think that your feelings towards the friends are irrational and that he did not do anything wrong, but I would like absolutely to take my hat off for you for being able to realize this. If shed apply anyways, what was the point of asking? The bulk of my team had moved over to a new company as part of an acquisition back in 2012, and they brought me over the following year. I think what hurts the most for you LW, is the folks who laid you off are the folks who your friend wants to work with. an abusive volunteer is holding our website hostage, boss says its unprofessional not to start an email with a greeting, and more, how to professionally say I told you so, the managers who feel personally betrayed when workers quit. I dont need 100 examples to believe your real life example. When I was laid off I actually preferred we had quite long notice period, nor did I feel too unhappy about it because I was looking forward to freelancing. ), whatever works. Im on the side of this sounds like a shitty way to go about laying off people, but clearly Im not in the majority here. Personally, I find journaling helpful since its a safe space to release your feelings. Honestly, most companies have had layoffs at some point in time. When a friend offers you a job, you can be relatively certain that shes well aware of your career aspirations, your professional goals, the things you do well, and the tasks you dread. As irrational as it is, I feel as though this friend is now stealing my dream job from me, even though the position they are applying for is not the same as the one that I was laid off from. They did you so wrong that I wont work there, but you should work there every chance you get because theyre awesome!. The relationships arent personal in the same way. Because this is the second and more important part: You still have some processing to do about what happened (and not with your friend). And if the most marketable people dont work in the areas that are going to be cut, you still need to do cuts and then rehire for the skills youre now missing. Heck, I dated at least five people I worked with back when I was in the service industry in my teens and early twenties. She might not be able to separate the you that is her best friend and the you that is her supervisor, this can end badly. I think quite the opposite that my working decisions are none of my friends business, and that they have no right, moral or whatsoever, to interfere in them. COMING UP: 7 AM ET - Wake Up America 9 AM ET -. Youll get through it, however things shake out with your friends application process. For so many of us, our professional options can feel narrowed due to a number of external reasons that we cant control. I am as well, and Im glad its a position OP ultimately likes! Just do your best not to act in a way you know is irrational or counter-productive. And good personal relationships require such an honest look at oneself, in a way that almost opposes what a business relationship would sometimes. If I was LWs friend I would think the fact that she was contracting for them and would like to go back as a sign that it was a good company and there would be no harsh feelings if I worked there. I can absolutely understand my friend not connecting that to a larger picture that points to an insecure job situation. Should I suck it up and be helpful and encouraging to my friend? Its all business, but also it is our livelihood, and in the US specifically, benefits. Just figure out what you cant do, what you can do, and offer to do that. Layoffs are common. If y'all do work together, just keep work and not work separate. Some even happened in my department. I spent time visualizing where each path led. Im so sorry that happened to you twice! Compassionate and rational. how much transparency does a manager owe employees in an internal hiring process? Explain your predicament and ask for answers. 7 Reasons why your friend working at your job is a bad idea, do not have to tell your friend that you are jealous, My Boyfriend Treats Me Like A Princess (6 Reasons Why), My Boyfriend Treats Me Like Im Stupid (6 Reasons Why), My Boyfriend Says I Make Everything About Me (5 Reasons), My Friend Keeps Bringing Up My Ex (Reasons & Solutions), My Friend Keeps Bringing Up The Past (6 Reasons Why), She may criticize you and you may criticize her. Getting stuck in a perpetual negative cycle . But Im side-eyeing this friend, hard. I was traumatized and deeply hurt by this because I had finally found a job I was good at during the recession, only to be sacked due to something completely out of my control. With a solid friendship as the base for your professional relationship, youll find its a lot easier to communicate with your boss during the workday. Also, I was in a country where laying off people is a multi-week process, with a warning, and the company paid for a legal consultation for me with a lawyer of my choice. Really, this does suck! But it sure wasnt. Its OK that sometimes we cant support our friends in the exact way they want to be supported because of our own weird shit, and most friendships can survive that.
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